Hand Calls or E-Caller???

[ScottD]

Didn't know where to put this, so I thought I'd start here and let Bobcat move it if he wants to. ;D

Anyway, I'd like to take a poll on do you guys use hand calls exclusively, or an e-caller exclusively, mixture of both, and why?

ScottD

[Byron South]

Thanks for the question ScottD.
I use both. If I'm just hunting by myself I like to use hand calls. If I'm trying to film by myself I use my e-caller. If I'm taking a guy that has a hard time sitting still, e-caller is going. E- callers are also good in the thick stuff. You can sit down wind of the caller and sometimes catch them trying to cut the wind. It sounds like I use the e-caller a lot, but I actually only use it about 50% of the time. There is just more satisfaction in calling in a coyote with a hand call, especially if you made it yourself.

Thanks

Byron

[jdickey]

8-)Hey Byron... I must agree with you about hand calls. It is more satisfying to use them instead of e-calls. So much stuff is high tech now, it's just not the same, and to me, not near as much fun! I've got a small collection of old calls, some are over 75 years old, and they still do the job! Never made any calls, but maybe some day...

[ScottD]

Thought there'd be more replies than this, but I still find it somewhat "refreshing" or "different" that the focus here seems to be satisfaction rather than success. So let me throw in a different twist:

If you were in a situation where success DID matter, as in a guided trip or some type of control situation, which call(s) would you use and why?

ScottD

[onecoyote]

jdickey, wow a 75 year old predator call, I find that very interesting indeed, does it have a name on it? The oldest calls I ever heard of that were made by a company were olts way back in the 50s and in the 40s an Indian gave a hand call to a guy named Ray Alcorn who was a goverment hunter up in northern Nevada. Some say he is credited with starting modern day predator calling in the 40s but I think it's Morton Burnham from Texas back in 1903, I somehow think you Texans will agree to that one lol. Ray Alcorn was actually from Bishop California. Anyways jdickey, I'd like to know more about that call if it's possible, Good Hunting.

[Bobcat]

jdickey,

I would also like to hear more about that call!!

ScottD,

I use both too........I guess right now I am about 75/25 electronic/hand. I do a lot of calling by myself and like to get the sound out away from me. There is still something special about calling them in with a good hand call though.

Bob

[jdickey]

;)I never seen a name on that old call. It belonged to my grandfather and my dad said that he remembers him using the call when my dad was about 8 or 9. My dad is 82 years old. so the age of the call is a best guestimate. It's about 6" long and made of cedar, with a brass reed that is adjustable.

I've got a WEEMS call that is around 45 years old, could be older; a MALLARD TONE that is about the same age. My dad used them a lot and have been passed down!

[Bobcat]

Maybe Jay Nistetter can give us a hand here in indentifying your call. For those of you who don't know, he co-authored a very good book on the history of hand calls.

Bob

[elalto]

It’s been a while but I do remember that I really enjoyed calling in a varmint with my Weems, Olt, and Burnham Bros. calls. I used the hand calls mostly at night as I could never use them without moving too much which gave me away during the day. I used to make electronic callers out of old four track car players, powered them with 12-volt motorcycle batteries. My electronic callers worked quite well and I used them during daylight calls mostly.

I don’t know why but hearing the repetitive wails of the recorded calls, at night, just sort of un-nerved me. I felt much more comfortable having “control” of the sound, tone and volume I really enjoyed seeing the reaction of the varmint as I controlled the distress call. My partner and I would take turns on the call and the gun, I hardly ever varmint hunted alone. The last year or so I took very few shots preferring to call them in for new or less experienced hunters.

So I suppose that my choice is hand calls especially when hunting at night and with a partner.

Marcos
[e-mail]

[jdickey]

8-)One of my old calls is an P.S. Olt pin tail duck call. It has a sliding tone adjuster and is plastic. It's probably 50 years old, and still works great.

[Byron South]

ScottD,

I now understand your question. I have heard it both ways as to which is more productive. In my IMHO I don't beleive it has so much to do with the call used, but who is using it, and how he is using it. They both have advantages. With modern technology these e-callers are getting lighter and more user friendly, but I don't think they will ever take the place of hand calls. I honestly believe it boils down to how you use it, and not necesarily what kind you use.

Byron

[Jay Nistetter]

Barring crow and raccoon calls, the first commercially made predator call was the Higley Animal Call made in 1948.

I would like to see a picture of your call, preferably taken apart in order to see the adjustable brass reed and its approximate size. The best way to do this is to place a quarter in the photo. The actually call barrel will more than likely allow identification of who made it.

There were several variations of predator type calls made prior to 1948, but these were creations by ADC personnel and a few of us affectionately call the “coffin calls”. Other types of predator calls used by ADC men were actually duck calls with the tone-board and reed pulled out of the barrel so that they could use them as an open reed call. The most popular being the Olt J-15 and D-2 duck calls.

[Jay Nistetter]

As a sidenote, the first Weems was available in 1956. It was all wood. I would need to see it to determine whether it was made in 1956, 1957 or 1958.

If your Weems is plastic, the earliest one was made in 1960. Again, I would need to see it to determine what year it was made and what model it is.

Color, wood type, shape and decal are all clues to which one you may have.

The famed Ray Alcorn call is in a collection of a certain individual that many of you know or have heard of.

[Bobcat]

jdickey,

I hope you can get some info to Jay. Your calls sound really interesting.

Here is some details about Jay and Al's book:
Predator Calls, The First 50 Years.

Jay Nistetter (Rhino Calls) and Al Lux (Lux Predator Calls) have teamed together to create the most comprehensive and useful book written about predator calls.

These two fellas have been active predator callers for over 30 years. In this book you will find virtually every commercial predator call made beginning with the very first commercially advertised predator call in 1948.

Published in 2002 and limited to only 750 regular copies and 250 numbered copies, this hardbound book contains over 300 color-filled pages consisting of more than 1200 impressive color photos identifying calls and call makers. This book also provides historical information as well as dates and collectible ratings of predator calls.

Excerpt for book:

"The earliest predator calls were designed and advertised as deadly on fox. Although I haven’t looked deeply into actual records of the day, it would appear that fox were once the dominant predatory critters in most areas. At some point in time, Mr. Coyote took center stage and the old sly fox became less important.

Since the commercial advent of wildlife calls specifically designed and marketed to attract predatory animals, many shapes, sizes, colors and materials have come and gone.

Since the late 40’s, call companies have constantly improved their product, expanded production, moved locations, changed their materials and added new items to their product line in order to meet the demands of the newly crowned “predator hunter”.

In the late forties and early fifties the earliest available commercial calls were made of woods and some cow horns. Hand made reeds were fitted into a barrel of sorts. Scattered in with the wooden calls were also calls made of tennite and bakelite. Calls of these materials were heated inside molds in order to harden. As the rapidly growing sport of calling predatory animals grew, so did the numbers of call makers. The seventies saw the decreasing use of wooden calls and an increase in the number of manufacturers producing calls made from plastics which yielded greater profits.

Collecting early calls can be both rewarding and frustrating. Many of the now defunct companies have left no real trail of historical records in order to date their ever-changing lineup of products. Labels, boxes, instructional sheets and decals all noted similarities, but subtle changes were continually being made. Examples of this are easy to overlook and may be discovered by a mere address change, the addition of the zip code in 1963, color and size variations of their logos, special edition coloring, specially contracted merchandise, brochure changes showing a 45rpm record instead of the older 78’s and more.

You will see a pictorial parade of some of the more well known predator calls that have come and gone as well as predator calls still marketed today, laced with a few custom call makers. Many of the predator calling pioneers that have used the calling devices pictured deserve mentioning but I am inclined to leave that for another book."

[jdickey]

;)I'll try to get some pics for you Jay. I know the Weems call is in the era you're talking about. It is all wood and still has the green & yellow decal. The Mallard Tone is all wood, and the name is branded into the wood.

The other wooden one that belonged to my grandfather and without the name, could possibly be a duck call, but we've always used it as a predator call because of its pitch and tone. Don't know of any duck that sounds like it does! But, it works great as a predator call!

The P.S. Olt is all plastic, thick plastic with adjustable tone reed.