For a different kind of self-defense

[DoeNob]

That so called "Bear expert" was a nut case and got what he was asking for, in my opinion. The real tragedy of the situation was the woman was also killed and partially eaten, I don't think she signed up for that. Read this article by Humberto Fontova for a take on that issue I largely argee with and if you think I'm being way too harsh, I'll be glad to discuss it with you.

www.lewrockwell.com/fontova/fontova43.html

[Bobcat]

We have a thread on that here also:
txpredatorposse.proboards19.com/index.cgi?board=welcome&action=display&thread=1065618053

Bob

[Mohawk]

Guys,
After my post of earlier this PM, I went over to the site Sarge recommended. Wow! Talk about some serious eye candy! Those chunks would turn just about any autoloader fan into thinking about revisiting the wheelgun! They're all nothing short of works of art! The one with which I was most impressed, by the way, was the custom Ruger Redhawk .454 Casull with its double-action feature and full-lug Krieger barrel. Hell, it's gotta be an exceptional shooter with a Krieger barrel on it!

Also, I did a Yahoo search on the .454 Casull cartridge to get a feel for its potency and all I have to say is . . . d**nATION, IT'S A MEAN SON-OF-A-pregnant dog!!! One article explained that it can drive 260-grain slugs at > 2000 fps given 7.5" of tube. I suppose that BCA's 6" barreled custom Redhawk could get 'em going at least 1850 fps if this is accurate. The article also mentioned that this kind of performance makes the .454 Casull almost 2X as powerful as the .44 Magnum. I don't think any land animal, regardless of size and/or constitution, would keep coming after getting hit once or twice with something like that! Unfortunately, it cautioned that the recoil is equivalent to that generated by an 8.5-lb sporter rifle chambered for the .300 RUM!

Okay fellas, I'll stop talkin' ya'lls ears off now. I gotta e-mail my sister's doctor boyfriend and then go and look at the stuff on those Alaskan bear fatalities!

Peace,
Dave

[Mohawk]

DoeNob,
UGH!!! Just read your article there, pal. Man, oh man, I can see what's got my sister's boyfriend so worked up about his Alaskan hiking/fishing trips!

So whaddya think, guy? Will that BCA custom Ruger .454 Casull be the right medicine for the big, fuzzy man-eaters of coastal Alaska?

Dave

[1st cav sgt ret]

some article it sez it took 12magnum rounds to put it down(and I think they are armed with 375H&Hs somebody correct me on this if im wrong)and yes that BCA ruger 454 looks sharp I would definately have it vented tho I dont know if it would put a bear down or not but it would definately give the bear something else to thing about(ie this aint gonna be a free lunch litteraly) bowens definately builds some nice pieces

[1st cav sgt ret]

dang I think Ive talked myself into getting one,ya just never know about those nasty sabertoothed p-dogs ;D

[Bobcat]

I guess I don't understand why you would want a .454 over a .500 S&W?

Bob



"Despite the power of the cartridge, the 500 S&W Magnum is surprisingly controllable. Due largely to the sheer mass of the revolver (combined with the muzzle-heavy balance and an excellent muzzle brake), the violent wrist-wrenching muzzle whip associated with single-action revolvers firing such powerful loads as the .454 Casull and the .475 Linebaugh has been tamed considerably.

In those guns, muzzle rise on recoil can reach 90° and present a hazard to the shooter. With even the heaviest 500 Magnum load tested, muzzle rise was confined to the 50° range and there was never any concern about the shooter wearing an imprint of the front sight in his forehead. That does not mean it's a girl thingycat. Make no mistake about it, this is not a handgun for the timid or the inexperienced. In comparison tests, the lightest 500 load--the 275-grain jacketed hollowpoint at 1665-ft.-per-second (fps) velocity--produced a modest, but noticeable, increase in recoil levels over a S&W Model 629 .44 Magnum. Anyone who is uncomfortable with the .44 Magnum will be decidedly uncomfortable with the 500 Magnum. The 440 cast-lead load at 1625 fps raised the recoil bar significantly. Muzzle rise still remained under 50° and placed little or no stress on the wrists, but the rearward thrust absorbed by the shooting hand began to become uncomfortable after 10 to 15 rounds. A shooting glove would have mitigated some of that.

Still, considering that the projectile weight and velocity of this load is virtually identical to a 1-ounce 12-ga. rifled lead shotgun slug--and that the 500 Magnum operates at over four times the pressure level of the slug--the recoil was less than expected. We'd say that Dirty Harry would certainly approve."

[1st cav sgt ret]

bobcat the only reason I havent touched on the 500smith it is to new and I have no experance with the cartg or revolver except what I have read ,therefor I simply dont know what it will or wont do,and I hesitate to give my opinion(which is strictly my own)it may verywell be the end all revolver and ctg I dont know(while I freely admit itht I have never been charged by a grizzly bear I have been "attacked"?by a pair of rotweilers,granted they werent bears however the intent,both theirs and mine were the same,a fight to the death,they werent playing and nether was I)therefore I have recomended cals and pistols that I beleive will work given that situation(no slam intended just my own interpretation of the subject)

[DoeNob]

I agree with Bobcat on this one. I have not shot the S & W, but I have 2 guys at the duck lease that own one, I have held it and read quite a bit about it. I think the hype on this one is accurate, Smith and Wesson is a company that turns out reliable products and I think if there were any problems with the gun, I would have heard something by now. Also, more knockdown power, a more manageable and shootable weapon make all signs point to .500. And for just over a grand, I think its a heck of a bargain, too.

[Mohawk]

Gents,
Dr. Rice said he was gonna give this one (the S&W .500 Magnum) serious consideration as well. 'Course, I don't see why he would want anything else either given the above posted figures.

Up to 2600 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle, eh! Ain't a bear alive that could have his way with a man or woman that beat him/her to the punch with that kind of power at their disposal!!!

Dave

[sormi]

[1st cav sgt ret]

hey sormi try again please,all I get is a box with an x in it(dont worry I havent got this picture posting down yet eather)new slogan for animal activits HUG TREES NOT BEARS ;D ;D

[AlleninAlaska]

He went on to admit that in most areas of that state, carrying any kind of a firearm is illegal,

That's a fallacy. Only illegal to have a firearm in National Parks. Open carry is legal. We have a Vermont style CCW law. It is legal to carry concealed while hiking in the backwoods.

Now what would I carry? I have carried a Ruger Blackhawk in either 41 mag, 45 Colt or a Super Redhawk in 480 Ruger. I have had my 41 mag since 1976 and it is loaded with heavy for caliber hard cast bullets as are all my handguns used for hunting. Have had my 45 Colt since the late 70's and it was redone by Hamilton Bowen to be a 5 shooter so I could load beyond what the majority of 45 Colt handguns will not take as far as hot loads go. I am loading a 370 grain hard cast bullet for it at an honest 1375 FPS from the 6.5" barrel. With good handloads in a very strong revolver the 45 Colt is heads above the 44 mag and will be right on the heels of the 454 with less powder. I have taken moose, musk ox, caribou and black bear with these handguns and have yet to feel under gunned. Would I hesitate to use one for the larger coastal bears, I don't think so. The secret IMHO to handguns used for protection from 4 legged critters that may bite back is a good hard cast bullet. I have never recoverd one of these bullets from an animal yet. Why use an expanding jacketed bullet from a slow cartridge that will slow down even more upon initiating the expansion process?

Beside I don't have to worry about the big bears when hunting with out of state residents, I know that when it comes time to sleep I will get a good nights sleep because the non-resident will be awake all night watching for bears. ;D

[sormi]

First cav. Click on the link.
genji.image.pbase.com/u37/sormi/upload/23815680.44tarus.jpg

I like this set up because it's easy to carry and easy to hide. It has a 2 inch barrel. When you are out fishing and if a Bear shows up, there is not much you can do. If you jump in the water you are going to drown or freeze to death. You can't run up or down the river because there are too many trees in the way.
I think there is more chance to get attacked by a crankey moose than a bear.

[1st cav sgt ret]

thankx for youre input allan,I have a S/W in 45colt that I have been considering sending to bowen for sometime.maybe now is a good time.yeper I would be up all night going what the h### is that