Match HPBTs for hunting

[Mohawk]

Gentlemen,
Have any of you ever used any of the more popular match HPBT designs (e.g. Sierra MKs or Lapua Scenars) for hunting? The reason I ask is because the more and more confident I become that I can clip an animal at distances up to and over 600-700 yds, the more I feel like I don't have any choice but to use such designs by virture of their enormously greater long range accuracy over bonded-core projectiles. After all, I've never owned a rifle (and I have some d**n fine ones) that could hold under 1.5 MOA for 5 rounds at distances over 500 yards with bonded-core (hunting) projectiles. But not one of them wasn't capable of shooting sub-1.0 to 0.5 MOA groups all the way to 1000 yards as long as I used match HPBTs.

Now, I've seen the results of using match HPBTs on game at distances up to 500 yards, and they were less than ideal, but the animals were down and out just as quickly as if a Nosler BT or Hornady A-Max had been used. The thing is, these were small animals (< 150-lbs) with relatively thin skin. Think I could hope for the same on a > 200-lb feral hog or something even larger and tougher standing really far out if the projectile weighs 185 grains and has an initial velocity of 3000 fps? In other words, what are the limits if such bullets are used at all?

Dave

[CoonDawg]

Well stranger they will work if you are using the heavier ones 190, 240 and 300. Bigger holes and just as hard hitting the animal, but you still need placement.

Just try not to shoot anything under 50 yards or you'll lose lots of meat ;D

Lorenzo

[Mohawk]

Lo,
Exactly right, man! These slick little boogers are no good at close range. One particularly illustrative instance of this occured several years back on the game lease my dad's former employer maintained near Hondo: One of dad's clients insisted I let him use a .338 Lapua Magnum tactical rifle I had taken out there just for the purposes of doing some 1,500-yd target shooting (not for hunting) to get him a Corsican ram. He ended up hitting this little cull-of-a-specimen at a little over 100-yds. It was a shocking spectacle, appearing through my binoculars as if a small exposive device had been detonated from inside the animals thoracic cage. Mind you, it didn't cut the poor beast in half or anything -- some jokers would have us believe that any rifle firing projectiles heavier than 200 grains faster than an initial 3000 fps will do this to small, and even medium-sized, game animals, when even a .50 BMG won't yield such results. But the wound cavity was huge . . . and none of the bullet's mass even made through to the other side of the little ram's body. The most brow-raising part of this tale, however, is that the projectile weighed 250 grains! The following year, I shot a 160-lb Fallow buck at almost 350 yards with the same rifle and load and the results were a little closer to being acceptable. Nonetheless, the wound cavity was still huge, but at least part of the bullet passed through the other side of the deer's thoracic cage.

So it seems that these HPBTs -- which admittedly are designed expressly for competitive shooting and often come with warnings that they should NOT be used for hunting -- have a tendency to 'explode' upon splashing into ruminant tissue at super-high velocity. And that this tendency initially decreases as velocity decreases. But some 'authorities' insist that the relationship between their frangible tendency and velocity again reverses as the bullet really starts to slow down. This is specifically what I'm so curious about! Also, I surmise that there could be significant differences between bullets from different manufacturers and of different calibers/masses. But I wouldn't know first hand since I've only seen the results of using one bullet of one manufacturer and of one weight.

Best,
Dave

[CoonDawg]

I've seen a doe hit at 18 yards with a 338 LM loaded about 2950 nearly took off the front leg ;D but she was DRT

[MaBell]

Mohawk,

A few years ago I had the chance to do some cropping work on a large ranch in Texas. They needed to take 800 head of deer out so I tried a number of different rifles and loads at this time. One of the rifles was an extremely accurate heavy barrel .308 Win. My idea was to use 165 gr. Match Sierra's an just brake the necks for instant kills. This went fine until one morning I put a round through both lungs of a doe at about 145 yds. The doe never broke stride and 280 yds. later just slowed and fell over. If the cover had been heavier we might have lost her. When field dressing the animal we found a neat .30 cal. hole through both lungs, and a small exit hole. There was no blood trail, and very little blood on the outside of the animal. The bullet had not opened at all and just punched a clean hole like a FMJ would have.
I'll never use match bullets on big game again. They are not designed for this use, and are not predictable as to their preformance.
I might add this was not an isolated occurance, and we also had some blow-up on shoulders.

My opinion ,,,,, the amimal deserves better than this.

Hope this helps.

Good Shooting,
MaBell

[Mohawk]

MB,
Your point is well taken, amigo. That's why I posed the question in the first place. But I feel as though I would have quite a dilemma if I were trying for an animal that was 600-800 yards out, with deciding between using; a) a bullet with which the odds of good shot placement would be best, but superior terminal ballistics would be lost, or b) a bullet with which terminal ballistics would be more than sufficient, but the odds of good shot placement would be diminished greatly. In other words, the match HPBT might be unpredictable in terms of terminal ballistics, but is it any better to use a projectile that has inferior external ballistic properties over longer courses of flight, increasing the odds it will splash into a target animal's non-vital areas?


Dave

PS - Here's a good question! What bonded-core projectile(s) currently on the market provides for the best external ballistics over long courses of flight? I've yet to try Hornady's new SST design. And what about Swift's Scirocco design? I've only tried these in caliber .284 rifles (disappointing accuracy after 400 yards), but not caliber .30 rifles.