Barrel Breakin

[BozoWise]

This is a quote from Barrel Maker Bo Clerke in the Dec. 03 Predator Extreme magazine.

Q: How do you recommend a new barrel be broken in?
A: That's hogwash. The first shot breaks in a barrel. Don't overheat them and they won't need a break-in.

[Bobcat]

I still break my new barrels in......clean after each of the first 5 shots, then after each of the next 5-5 shot groups. Then normal cleaning with Butch's and use JB and/or Sweet's as needed.

A lot of folks just use Flitz or JB Bore paste on a new barrel also.

Bob

[BayouCityBoy]

I saw the quote also and it followed the line of other discusions I have seen on the issue in the past year.

Several years ago, if you didn't follow a rigid barrel break-in procedure, poor accuracy, the plague, and other assorted bad things would happen to you and your next of kin.

Now you are seeing more of the discussions along the line of "does it really work"? Even the Benchrest shooters seem to be questioning the need - some still believe in it - others don't. One even stated in the past that the whole process was invented by a barrel maker who wanted to sell more barrels.

Several years ago, I bought two identical model rifles a few weeks apart - one in 22/250 and the other in 243. I religiously broke in the 22/250 and just took the 243 and shot it. I didn't do this as a test - that's just how it worked out. I still have the 243 because it shot good out of the box and got better - the 22/250 never did shoot well and the barrel tended to copper foul and I got rid of it a while back. At least in this limited case for me, barrel break-in was useless. Probably the relative condition of the new barrels was the deciding factor in accuracy between the two rifles. Also, maybe the 243 was bedded better, etc. - who knows - but at least the original barrel condition of the 243 appeared to be better and it showed up in the results.

Probably the best way to get a good shooting barrel is to pay the money for a good quality barrel.

Just my two pennies.

[ICMCumin]

Bobcat - don't you want to keep your barrell clean anyway? When I am scoping my rifles (new or old) in, I just try to keep them relatively clean and the barrell temperature cool....

I have had two new rifles (a Weatherby Vanguard 300 wby Mag and a Remmy 788 .223) in the past two years and didn't do anything dramatic for any break-in period and both of them turned out to be real shooters.

The Remmy 788 in particular is about as close to a tack driver as I have seen coming out of the box (As a side note - the 788 was discontinued about 20 years ago. I bought one off auctionarms.com that was still in the box and had never been fired - kept in a closet for 20+ years. It has since lost its virginity.)

I guess I question what you accomplish by using a different procedure with a new weapon than with an older one, But to be sure, I am NO expert on this.....

[Bobcat]

We are talking about barrel break-in, not cleaning. The purpose of breaking in a barrel is to get rid of the "rough" spots so it will not foul as easily and will not build up layers of copper fouling affecting accuracy. During the first few rounds a lot of copper fouling will be left in the barrel. It is important to remove this fouling completely, after each shot, to help prevent a build-up later on. All of the major barrel manufacturers recommend a break-in of a new barrel. It anyone chooses not to, fine. A lot of folks don't believe in breaking in a new barrel......I happen to. I want all of my rifles to shoot sub-moa and not foul easily. If a barrel is not properly broken in it will tend to foul more easily and need to be cleaned more often. If you are only shooting it once a year at a deer it is not as critical. If you are predator or varmint hunting, it becomes very important.

Different strokes..........

Bob

[BayouCityBoy]

Bob:

Regarding your statement that "all of the major barrel manufacturers recommend a break-in of a new barrel"; that's a pretty strong statement.

I think you would agree that Shilen is a pretty good barrel maker. On their website they state, and they will tell you in person, that they have a barrel break-in procedure only because some of their customers seem to think they should have one. I have talked with several folks at another pretty good barrel making firm that will tell you that a good shooting/non-foulinging barrel isn't made at the range by a break-in process, but when the barrel is manufactured. (That is exactly what Bo Clerke is saying)They also have a break-in process for the same reason as Shilen. I won't get into their name because they do not publicly state it like Shilen does.

I relaize that others such as Lilja, a pretty good barrel maker also, strongly recommend a break-in procedure.

If the barrel is manufactured properly and lapped properly, all of the issues which a barrel break-in routine is supposed to "cure" are unnecessary. My point in my earlier post was that if you buy a poorly made barrel, it will remain a poorly made barrel in all aspects.

Alluding to the idea that breaking in a barrel properly will make all of your guns capable of MOA and easy to clean is pure fantasy. Many factory barrels are so poor out the door that they aren't capable of MOA and will tend to foul no matter how many times "the Pope blesses them". A well made barrel will shoot no matter what you "try to do to make it better". A poor one will not become a good one by a break-in process.

[CoonDawg]

I've never worried about breaking in a barrel on an out of the box rifle, but on the custom I'm having built I will break it in as per Mike Rock.

[Bobcat]

BCB,

You are correct about Shilen. I had forgotten about their statement. I had read that. I never "alluded" to anything and didn't intend to get into a pissing contest over this. I also never said you could make a silk purse out of a sows ear. It is ok to agree to disagree. I was stating what I do and why. You are also correct that well made custom barrels need far less break-in than factory barrels, which are much rougher. That is all the more reason, IMHO, to properly break-in a factory barrel. I think in the long run, it will serve you better if you do. And yes, I still break-in my custom barrels. I don't think this is a right or wrong thing like you seem intent on making it, but more a matter of personal preference. As you pointed out with Shilen, even the barrel manufacturers don't agree on this. I am not trying to preach to anyone or try to change anyones mind. I am simply stating what I do and why. I also pointed out that many folks now just use Flitz or JB and go for it. I have also been able to get all of my factory barrels/rifles to shoot sub-moa, but I never "alluded" that it was due to the break-in process. That is just a small part of it, again IMHO. You may very well be correct that it does absolutely nothing to help the life and/or accuracy of a barrel. I still choose to do it........maybe I just like to shoot........I don't know. That does not make either of us good or bad, or right or wrong......just different in our approach.

Good Hunting,

Bob

[BayouCityBoy]

Bob:

I think I stated that Lilja and I'm sure others, would disagree with the two I mentioned on the break-in issue which pretty well establishes there is no right or wrong answer. If you're in a "pissing contest', its not with me. - BCB

[Bobcat]

Hey BCB,

.........no problem. That is the trouble with computers, it is easy to misunderstand the intent at times.

Good Hunting,

Bob

[Dale]

I have heard both sides of this, just as in the above discussion. Here is the way I figure it. I am going to shoot those first 50 rounds any way. I clean after every single shot for the first 20 then after every 5 for the next 30. If the guys who say I need to break it in are right, then Ihave done a good thing. If the guys who say it is a waste of time, then that is all I have done...waste a little time, energy, and cleaning supplies. If I took a little life off of my barrel by the extra cleaning, then so be it, it can't be that much. And I don't go shoot an extra 100 rounds that I would have never fired, just because I am 'breaking in' the barrel. Like I said I would have shot those 1st 50 anyway.

Now to top it off...How did I come up with my break in procedure? Just my own little head! How did I come up with those numbers and how much I should clean...that same little head of mine.

Right or wrong......... Or is there a right or wrong?

[BozoWise]

I also found an interesting bit of information in that article stating that most problems with factory barrels is that they are mounted in no particular direct. The barrels that are mounted backwards ( or in the opposite direction of tooling) will tend to fould more and thus effect accuracy. The rifles that are mounted in the same direction as tooling will not and thus the breakin is non-exsistent. Goo point of thought on the 22-250 and 243 discussed.

I have gone both ways on the breakin and choose to breakin an out of the box rifle just for the purpose of watching fouling. If it fouls up I get another rifle, and having an FFL makes that easier to do. New model Ruger #1 are a prime example. I have order up to 3 of the same rifle to find one that would shoot well enough out of the ox to start working with. I had one in 25-06 that grouped about the size of a paper plate at 100 yards.

As far as custom barrels. Most people that install the barrels will fire test rounds and thus the barrel has already been subjected to either fouling or proper breakin before you get it.

I also take into consideration the experience with the 10/22 that I build. I have built more 10/22 then I would want to know as I do this as one of my favorite builds and there are many varmit and siloutee shooters in my area. I have yet to find a 10/22 that shot better clean then dirty. Many other barrels are like this. Clerke's advise is shot a barrel till it tells you it needs to be cleaned. When accuracy falls clean it. I have one 10/22 that has well over 5,000 rounds fired through it and one the action has been cleaned via a quick sray of arisol cleaner. Any of my target 10/22's get cleaned after each match and then before the next match I will fire atleast 50 rounds to chick sight in and dirty up the barrel. You can see accuracy improve drasticly through the first 10-20 rounds.

Just some thought not all facts for people to think about.

[BayouCityBoy]

Bozowise:

I had forgotten Clerke's comments about tooling direction and barrel installation. Your reminder caused me to dig up the magazine and read the article again.
When I originally read that, I didn't think in terms of the 22/250 and 243 example I used in my first post, but it may have been an issue.

When I first read the article last month, the direction issue made me wonder how many of the Rugers I have had in the past 25 years that refused to shoot well were caused by this issue. I shoot a right handed bolt gun left handed, so I really like the tang safety Ruger 77 action, but have had some really poor shooters for rifles from Ruger until you get them re-barreled.

They have admited that at one time their barrels were contracted out and were suspect, but this issue may have made some of those worse. All this makes you really question what you're buying, huh?

Ah, to swab or not to wab - will it really help? - is that the question??
- BCB ;D

[ICMCumin]

Doggone it Bobcat - I just keep learning good stuff from you!!!! ;D ;D ;D

[GonHuntin]

To the best of my knowledge, all of the well known custom barrel makers lap their barrels......if there are still rough spots in the bore after lapping.....shooting and cleaning probably won't fix it.........

I use to be in the "break in" camp (factory barrels)......now, I usually just shoot the thing and see if it is a fouler.....if so, a hundred passes with JB bore paste or the Remington abrasive cleaner may help smooth it up.......but I don't worry about it much anymore since I started using Wipe Out bore cleaner. This stuff is amazing and I'd never go back to brushes and ammonia based copper removers.

I've even heard of guys claiming it helps to do a "proper" break in on a used rifle .....heck, if it's a used barrel it is probably as "broke in" as it's ever going to get! I'd sure like someone to explain how "breaking in" a used barrel is possible? I think what happens when someone sees an improvement by "breaking in" a used barrel, is that they actually get the barrel clean and WOW it shoots better!!! Who would have ever thought it? ;D

Bottom line.....I think factory barrels get smoothed up by shooting and cleaning.....whether in a "break in" ritual or just in the normal course of shooting or working up loads......After looking at a few factory barrels though a bore scope.....I'm amazed that any of them shoot at all! As far as custom barrels go.....I don't see how shooting and cleaning a hand lapped custom barrel can make it any smoother than it is when it leaves the factory....in fact, logic and looking through a bore scope tells me just the opposite!

But I could be wrong


PS: Don't ever bore scope a factory barrel on your best out of the box rifle!!! You will be shocked and will wonder how it will send bullets into the same zip code!!!